Conversions and Other Lost Arts
Posted By Kathleen David on April 28, 2006
I was informed last night in not so many words that I am not artist and should not be playing in the sandbox with other science fiction artists but stick to my doll and puppet people and leave them alone. One individual in a chat room almost ruined my evening. Now this person is not a moderator and the moderator who knows me just let it be which was probably the right thing to do in this case. The person shortly left the chat room after a couple of others started conversing with me.
From what I can sort out I stepped on his toes talking about digital art and the sale of prints based on digital art which is mostly how this person does their art. I was talking about people who use the “South Park” character generator and then print and sell the images as their own since they put them together. Apparently I used a hot button word for this person by saying Avatar. Everyone has to start somewhere but that is a start. Part of being an artist is expanding on what you know and have done.
The question to the room that started all this was
At what point should an artist be told they aren’t any good and they should stick with their day job?
Personally I would never tell anyone to stick to their day job. There are some artists that play well on the con circuit that would never be hired to do a book cover or professional illustration. There are some that do these professional gigs and don’t do well on the con circuit. And then there are the others that can flow between the two. There is art in art shows of all kinds that makes me wonder what the head of the show was thinking but it is their show and they have the right to say what is in and what is out.
Which led to another sore point about whether the directors of these shows should explain why you are not in their show. I say No they should not have to explain themselves. There are vagaries that they can say that cover all the bases and almost no one’s feelings get hurt. Apparently I was wrong in those thoughts as well according to this one person.
But there is another side of this that was never really discussed within the chat but did show up on the group list. As an artist, writer, fill in the creative blank you have to be able to take criticism of your work. You can choose whether you are going to listen to what is said or not but that is your choice. I put my snake puppet out for a group of puppeteers I admire and respect to look at. Some came back with comments that seemed a little harsh but valid as to what I was trying to do with the snake. I answered with additional information when asked and thought about the comments really hard. I ended up incorporating a couple of the suggestions and saying “different strokes” on others. In the end I ended up with a much better looking snake. If you want the “Oh that is so cool” comments then you have to take also the “not to be too critical but” comments as well. Both will make you a better artist.
I guess why I got so torqued was that I have been dealing with this “are dolls or puppets art” debate for a long time. (There is a costuming version of this but that is a whole other rant) I think you can guess what my position is on the matter. Believe me there is as much work in one of my pieces as there is in an elaborate oil painting. Sure I can’t exactly sell prints of my work unless I do photographs of my work but that is part and parcel of what I do. I am an artist and proud of that title.
On a totally different subject sort of. There is this puppeteer who does just wonderful stuff. He has been working on this goofy looking chicken for a while that is just a stitch to look at just on its own. I so want a plush of it. He showed us another piece he did a while ago that was this really spooky dead astronaut which reminded me of this dead body I did over 20 years ago for a play called the Changeling by Thomas Middleton. My brother borrowed the dead body of Diaphanta and we turned into Dead Elvis for one of the first Elvis parties he threw. To this day I can’t find my pictures of the body I made or of the Elvis it turned into. Got me to thinking about how much of my work is out there without any record other than my memory of making it. I think I need to be more careful of keeping a record of what I have done because I have done some pretty cool stuff in my time.
I am grateful that I stayed in the chat yesterday.
Hmm, it’s an interesting question. I must admit I’ve always thought of puppet-making the same way I’ve thought of glass-blowing or woodworking (or costuming) – it’s a highly specialized craft needing lots of skill and, as you say, taking lots of time. Which makes the crafting itself An Art, of course, but I don’t know that I would deem the finished product to be Art (sans indefinite article). I’d probably come down on the side of “if the product is functional and has a practical purpose in and of itself other than to entertain, it’s Design or Craft; if the primary purpose of the product is to entertain it’s Art” (which would make you an artist). But I must admit I haven’t given the matter nearly as much thought as you have, so I’ll defer to your superior expertise on the matter.
Uh… puppeteers, whether making or performing, are artists. In my opinion, some of the best artists around, even. Implying that you aren’t an artist is an insult to all artists.
As for the “not any good” bit… as you mention later, and artist must be able to take criticism of their work. The artist who simply can’t bear any criticism is the one who probably ought to stick with their day job. Having been the focus of lots of criticism in my day for my writing, I’ve slowly developed a thick enough skin to accept that most people who criticize are trying to make you better. And while it’s really hard to listen to, criticism is essential if you intend to develop as an artist.
Why would you *ever* tell *anyone* to stick with their day job? The very phrase “day job” implies that your regular work is failing to satisfy your needs, be they economic, intellectual, creative, whatever. No matter how badly you suck at it, it is still what you want to do, so follow your bliss and all.
Now, if you need the second job to pay for itself, or make money, sure, you should choose something where your skills are at a commercial level. (I am actually more than breaking even of late with my Art, but I am glad I never had to.) If you want the respect of others in the field, you should be open to their criticisms and be willing to put effort into improving your skills. (Again, thank goodness I am a jerk and don’t care. But I still work to improve to make myself feel better.) And if you actually aren’t happy with the extra work, you should be honest enough with yourself to admit it isn’t your bliss, and look for something else. But you should never have to just give up and stick with the 9-5 just because you aren’t any good. It’s not the point.
As for “Who is an Artist?” it’s as open as “What is Art?” Elayne pegged the usual dichotomy pretty well, in that if it has a practical application, it’s not capital-A Art, but rather “just” Craft. But in a world where Warhol can get praise for painting soup cans, and entire shows are built around off-the-shelf bathroom fixtures, such divisions are shown to be false. It’s not a question of Art *or* Craft, but how much of each. I mean, would the Mona Lisa stop being Art if it had a peg to hold coats? The Art Deco school says that Form should Follow function, while the Baroque don’t care. Certainly there can be a very utilitarian Craft without a speck of Art in it. But it is also possible to have an “elegant” or “ornate” Craft that considers aethetics as well as application. Conversely, sculpture requires more physical skill than painting, and musical composition less. But we don’t sell Michelangelo’s “David” at Sears simply because it involves a little sweat. (Though we do sell Picasso’s at Costco…) Art vs. Craft is the same argument as Art vs Commerce, and both do a disservice to creativity to value it only when it has no value. As above, how much money you do or do not make, how much work you do or do not put into the work, has nothing to do with how pleasing it is (or isn’t) to our reptilian hindbrain.
Kath, don’t let that individual bring you down. He/she sounds entirely too full of themself.
Here is a definition from my Art Student son:
….” Craft is a practice, Art is a product of human creativity. However because craft is the product of human creartivty it is art, or rather an art form.”…
“I was talking about people who use the “South Park” character generator and then print and sell the images as their own since they put them together.”
This probably comes under ‘appropriation’ because they are using a similar style that has been created by Trey and Matt (place Stone and Parker in the appropriate places and win a free nah im stingy, never mind). But then again how can you say that they aren’t taking their style from any of the traditional ‘Japanese’ animations or other animations that were ‘puppets’ and filmed in a similar style. It basically comes down to the argument of what is art and it can be really applied to what has occured to the “South Park” character generator.
Also its a humourous thing to note that the “South Park”, I hesitantly call ‘style’, was formulated by a pair of art school dropouts (according to one of my lecturers). The only reason why Trey Parker and Matt Stone or what ever they hail themselves by, have fame is because of a small ‘skit’ they did for George Clooney, but I digress.
The above paragraphs are from my Art Student son and are his (Alex’s) opinions
Megan
I think there is absolutely a point where someone (some VERY CLOSE to a person, not another artist) has to say this isn’t goign to work out. I said to one person, this gentleman was in his late 30’s and honestly no where near good enough to draw comics and had a wife and kids and admittedly going through some financial hardship caused at least in part by his pursuing “his bliss”, that he wasn’t close to his goal, that it would take ALOT more time, and I outlined everything he had to learn, and suggested he think real hard about whether achieving this goal was worth the additional time and sacrifice he was going to have to put in. And you know what? I think I did the responsible thing.